May Forgery Challenge - Final Vote [Archive]

Null Parameter

06-04-2009, 12:42 AM

May Forgery Challenge
Big Team Building
Final Vote

Here it is, the Final Vote. These are the Top 5 BTB maps, selected from all of the entrants. Make sure to give them all a play and then come back to tell us which is your favorite!

Voting ends Sunday, June 7th 11:59:59PM Central.

The prizes are as follows...

The winner's map will receive a video created of it, by our Affiliate Sad Faic Productions

The winner and the runner up will earn themselves 1 month of Supporter Status (http://www.xforgery.com/forum/faq.php?faq=xf_supporter)
The winner will have the choice between 1600 Microsoft Points and a 3 month XBL membership
The winner will be given the "Contest Winner" Award
Bragging rights of course...

Here they are, in no particular order......

Tetradymite (http://xforgery.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2620) by AceOfSpades (http://xforgery.com/forum/member.php?u=429) & Cerberus Beast (http://xforgery.com/forum/member.php?u=617)
http://i492.photobucket.com/albums/rr286/AceOfSpades0707/Tetradymite/Tetradymite%20Official/80097998-Full.jpg

Sub-Station B (http://xforgery.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2406) by Bartoge (http://xforgery.com/forum/member.php?u=403)
http://i309.photobucket.com/albums/kk370/Bartoge/Sub%20Station%20B/s6.jpg

Ameliorate (http://xforgery.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2405) by ChAoTiC (http://xforgery.com/forum/member.php?u=632)
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb208/SilentEcho777/77816449-Full.jpg

Vale (http://xforgery.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2396) by R 2the EiKo (http://xforgery.com/forum/member.php?u=631)
http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt117/R2theEiKo/backdefense-1.jpg

Minesweeper (http://xforgery.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2583) by Sage (http://xforgery.com/forum/member.php?u=323)
http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk1/Grant_Mossman/79942516-Full.jpg

Voting Rules:

You need to have been a member before the vote was started.
You need to have at least 2 posts on XF from before the vote was started.

This is a very small measure against people simply recruiting their friends to join XF only to vote for their map.

Gunnergrunt

06-04-2009, 12:53 AM

I don't agree with Minesweeper at all, even though that's the one i've played the most... The attackers will always capture the flag. But it is an impressive BTB map for Construct.

Vale has a great layout but its lacking weapons and vehicles big time. It needs several quick modes of transportation such as mancannons and teleporters as well

Tetradymite needs BR starts to play decently, but asymmetric games play very well and the forging is top notch.

I was surprised when i played Substation B. The middle structure makes the map much larger and the tanks work well. It only plays well on Slayer variants though...

Ameliorate is well forged and has great gameplay as well. My only complaint is the open space and the killball...

I'll have to keep thinking about them before i vote, but I'm leaning towards Tetradymite or Ameliorate... http://www.bungie.net/images/News/NewsIcons/halo3_odst.gif

Pel

06-04-2009, 02:05 AM

I'm thinking on going with Tetradymite on this one. It plays oh so well!

Sotha Sil156

06-04-2009, 02:48 AM

The only one of these maps I've actually played is Substation B, which played amazingly well for slayer, not so much for flag games though.

Looks like someone is going to need to host some games to play these and the Feature Top 5...

Conkerkid11

06-04-2009, 07:13 AM

Of course my map isn't in the top five. Yippie, I'm so happy. I got beat by some map on Construct! I don't even know what to say... Ace, I give my best wishes to you. Maybe I should stop forging now.. Because this is the crappiest thing that has happened to be so far on this site.

Tetradymite
I love this map, there is no complaining here.

Sub-Station B
Love this map to, but I fealt it needed more.

Ameliorate
Much like Tetradymite, but I would have to go with Tetradymite. I didn't care much for the top floor of the red base. The windows were messed up, and there was to little cover.

Vale
Vale was made before the contest, and the creator didn't even forge on it during this month. He just saw the contest and posted his map in here. Plus, it's missing elements of BTB that Ameliorate and Tetradymite had. It looks like he just made a bunch of random geomerges in the dunes.

Minesweeper
I wish I knew why this beat out my map. I can't see anything on Construct running well with 16 people in the party. I don't even care if you put vehicles on the map, all it would lead to are a bunch of "Whoops I flew into the death barrier!" remarks.

R 2the EiKo

06-04-2009, 08:18 AM

Hey, thanks Conkerkid! Now you've gave me a real reason to remove you ;) Those random merges you mentioned are designed to be buried artifacts/structures. But, since this is my first map, you can suck on it. Good luck everyone, I don't expect to win, but it was cool seeing the competition. I'm using all the feedback I got to influence my next project.

Again, good luck guys and some sick maps.

Cerberus Beast

06-04-2009, 08:52 AM

@Gunnergrunt: Ace and I agree that BR starts really do enhance the gameplay on the map, in our opinions.

Personally, I think that Ameliorate was a very good map, and I am honored to have my map competing against it. One thing though: I felt that if I went outside of my base without vehicle support, I would get destroyed in an instant. It's probably just my bad BR and snipe though, so I couldn't really do anything. :)

Sub-Station B actually surprised me due to the fact that it made Rat's Nest feel so much larger than it usually does. Congratulations on the unique idea and being the only map in the top 5 from a different DLC map than Sandbox. I'm not so sure I agree with the tank, but it was still a fun game, nevertheless.

Vale had some very nice structures, and it was actually one of the most structurally beautiful maps I have seen so far on Sandbox. It wasn't overall the most aesthetically pleasing map, but the structures were unique, and they lent themselves to gameplay well. The map is definitively open though, there is really no avoiding that. I would've thought a bit more about the LoS on the map before finalizing, as I found myself getting shot no matter where I was on the map without a way to hide, but it is still a very good first map.

No offense Sage, but I don't particularly understand why Minesweeper made it to the top five. The gameplay is okay, but it isn't anything super special. I will give you great note on your spawns though, as they were very well planned and well placed. Otherwise, I don't see anything too special about this map, other than that you managed to make it on Construct.

I'm not going to lie, I voted for my own map. However, Ace and Sage are currently working on revamping the spawns to eliminate any qualms people may have had about the spawns on the map. So, if you liked vanilla Tetradymite, the updated version should be even better. I'm not sure when it'll be released, but I can guarantee that it will play better than the original. DO NOT LET THAT AFFECT YOUR DECISION! Play EVERY map before you decide on a final decision for your vote. I want every one of you to have played at least one game on each map, just so that you have some credit to your vote.

doomgrunt

06-04-2009, 08:57 AM

Tetradymite
What a nice map. Professionally forged, and fun to play. If it had a problem, I can't remember it.

Sub Station B
Sorry Bartoge, I like normal Rat's Nest better. However, you do get points for having tanks. I don't think any of the other maps had tanks, and it was a BTB contest. You have to have tanks for BTB.

Ameliorate
I'm afraid the party I was in fell apart before I could play this map. Although, I did run through the map by myself and it looked very good.

Vale
I thought this was a good map. Unfortunately, it was lacking in weapons, and vehicles. A few quick changes could fix that right up.
Vale
Vale was made before the contest, and the creator didn't even forge on it during this month. He just saw the contest and posted his map in here. Plus, it's missing elements of BTB that Ameliorate and Tetradymite had. It looks like he just made a bunch of random geomerges in the dunes.
Vale is certainly NOT a bunch of random sandmerges.

Minesweeper
Meh. I didn't like this map when I ran though it with GunnerGrunt. It's a lot like normal construct and it has "cheatable" areas.

I believe my vote will be between Ameliorate and Tetradymite. If anyone is going to be playing Ameliorate, please send me an invite.

Sub-Station B actually surprised me due to the fact that it made Standoff feel so much larger than it usually does.

Rat's nest, not Standoff.

Master Debayter

06-04-2009, 10:03 AM

If anyone sees me online, and you decide to play any of these maps today, please send me an invite. Obviously I'm stuck between Tetradymite and Ameliorate, but I need to play each map another time until I can make the decision.

Null Parameter

06-04-2009, 10:03 AM

It's a lot like normal construct
This made me laugh. What was he supposed to do, build new structures with all of those immovable objects?

To those of you questioning Minesweeper and "how it beat [your] map", I'm sorry, but apparently people liked it more. Just because you love your map, doesn't mean that everyone else will. And just because you don't like a map, doesn't mean that everyone agrees with you.

Minesweeper brought in a lot of unique elements, including the canvas used, which also has the benefit of being static geometry, and the addition of pathways after 3 minutes. And as somebody else said, the spawns were great. This was obviously enough to give it the edge over other maps. It only proves my point more that right now Minesweeper has just as many votes as most of the other maps (and no, I didn't go vote for it just to say that :p).

It was a very close race for all of the spots, but there were some maps that didn't get much support at all, for one reason or another, and apparently Minesweeper was not one of them.

If you want more say in what makes it to the Top 5, become a Supporter (http://xforgery.com/forum/faq.php?faq=xforgery#faq_xf_supporter).

doomgrunt

06-04-2009, 10:13 AM

This made me laugh. What was he supposed to do, build new structures with all of those immovable objects?

Yeah, my bad, I should give him more credit. I should also play a real game on the map before I judge. I forgot about all the wonderful forging options he had. Still, I think it is the least impressive of the top five. Many of you will disagree with this, but I think that Substation B and Minesweeper are just too much like the canvases they were forged on. I know Sage and Bartoge didn't have much to forge with, but that's why the majority of maps are forged on either Foundry or Sandbox.

Zak

06-04-2009, 11:10 AM

Well, I gonna have to show Sage some love. I gonna have to vote for Minesweeper. While I don't like the looks of the teleporters everywhere, he has taken a map I hate and made it into something I love

Sage

06-04-2009, 11:13 AM

I don't agree with Minesweeper at all, even though that's the one i've played the most... The attackers will always capture the flag. But it is an impressive BTB map for Construct.

how do you know that

have you tested more then like 3 games because i have done like 30 and that is completely not true

when you actually play the map more then a few times you can tell me what always happens

doomgrunt

06-04-2009, 11:36 AM

how do you know that

have you tested more then like 3 games because i have done like 30 and that is completely not true

when you actually play the map more then a few times you can tell me what always happens

The drop pod block shown in this screenshot doesn't work, as I'm sure you know. You can still jump though it and jack the other teams flag...I think you referred to this as "strategy." This is what GunnerGrunt is talking about. Is it always going to happen? Probably not, but it will happen frequently.

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk1/Grant_Mossman/79942743-Full.jpg

xFear The Herox

06-04-2009, 11:48 AM

Denominator

06-04-2009, 11:55 AM

i have played every map on this top five, and every one that was submitted, i feel that my vote is going towards Minesweeper, this map was one of the few maps that didn't use sandbox, and he used the natural map to his advantage, plus this map was pre dlc which has some pull in my vote. the other maps like Tetradymite and Ameliorate were forged top notch and had some amazing game play, but i liked how construct was used in this map and i have had some good game play on this map, i'm sure with a few changes it will be up to everyones standards. i am going for the under dog on this one

But did you try it in the true spirit of the competition, Big Team Battle style? Admittedly, I haven't played any of them because I currently don't have an Xbox, but that's the biggest issue I see with Minesweeper. Even though it may be forged well, the underlying canvas is still not designed to hold 16 people.

Null Parameter

06-04-2009, 11:58 AM

But did you try it in the true spirit of the competition, Big Team Battle style? Admittedly, I haven't played any of them because I currently don't have an Xbox, but that's the biggest issue I see with Minesweeper. Even though it may be forged well, the underlying canvas is still not designed to hold 16 people.
Technically, the requirement was 12 - 16 people, and I've played many a successful 6v6 matches on default Construct.

Gunnergrunt

06-04-2009, 12:42 PM

how do you know that

have you tested more then like 3 games because i have done like 30 and that is completely not true

when you actually play the map more then a few times you can tell me what always happens

Why yes, actually, I have played about five or six matches on this. I think I even played several round with you in the party. The entire team had to be coached babysat through the map as we played.
A few others have mentioned that the spawns work well. The spawns, although they function well, are not well though out. If the attacking team dies, they spawn in the opposite purple room of the flag. From there, they can jump over both set of drop pods and get the flag. That, itself, is breaking the map to me.
But don't get me wrong, the map is fun. I just don't think it should be counted as BTB or compete with others in this contest.

And Null, you said people should become supporters to pick the top five right? Well in the contest thread, there were only like five or six people that actually gave their feedback. And the download count for the maps only went up like two or three during the process of choosing... I think you should have waited for more votes before you chose the top five. Conkerkid's map is a much better BTB map than Minesweeper.

Oh, and my vote goes to Tetradymite

I removed the votes from your post for a couple of reasons.

1. We don't want it to sway votes.
2. We don't want people who got only 0 or 1 votes to feel like their map was crap, even if it was.
3. It is in the Supporter Lounge for a reason, it's for Supporters.

Null Parameter

06-04-2009, 12:51 PM

And Null, you said people should become supporters to pick the top five right? Well in the contest thread, there were only like five or six people that actually gave their feedback.
Which is why we need more Supporters. Not everybody can be around all of the time, so we're bound to miss a few Support inputs each time we pick a Top 5. More Supporters == More Initial Feedback.

And the download count for the maps only went up like two or three during the process of choosing
You do realize that people don't have to click the "Download" link to play a map, right? I hardly ever download maps, I get them from other people. And I actually downloaded all of the BTB maps as they were entered.

Conkerkid's map is a much better BTB map than Minesweeper.Apparently nobody else agreed with you.

Gunnergrunt

06-04-2009, 01:14 PM

Well its just a frustrating system I guess. I don't think a vote has gone by that the majority has been happy with. There's really no point in being a supporter if something like that happens right? Well I dunno, I'll drop it.

Go Tetradymite go woo...

Null Parameter

06-04-2009, 01:18 PM

I don't think a vote has gone by that the majority has been happy with.
I would highly disagree with that comment. It's just the people who aren't happy with it that voice their opinions the most.

Bartoge

06-04-2009, 01:19 PM

Technically, the requirement was 12 - 16 people, and I've played many a successful 6v6 matches on default Construct.

And Construct is in Squad Battle.

One of the problems I see with some of these maps is it can all be dominated by vehicles everywhere. IMO, BTB maps need two types of places. ONe is open where vehicles rule. But there should also be some smaller areas where if a vehicle goes, it would most likely die.

Sage

06-04-2009, 02:32 PM

The drop pod block shown in this screenshot doesn't work, as I'm sure you know. You can still jump though it and jack the other teams flag...I think you referred to this as "strategy." This is what GunnerGrunt is talking about. Is it always going to happen? Probably not, but it will happen frequently.

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk1/Grant_Mossman/79942743-Full.jpg

hey im not an idiot
you can only jump through it if you move it forward some by throwing grenades at it or using the hammer

i have the objects to make that suply case immovable thats why only one side of it has weapon holders on it but i wanted it to be moved so there wasnt just one way in

Why yes, actually, I have played about five or six matches on this. I think I even played several round with you in the party. The entire team had to be coached babysat through the map as we played.
A few others have mentioned that the spawns work well. The spawns, although they function well, are not well though out. If the attacking team dies, they spawn in the opposite purple room of the flag. From there, they can jump over both set of drop pods and get the flag. That, itself, is breaking the map to me.
But don't get me wrong, the map is fun. I just don't think it should be counted as BTB or compete with others in this contest.

yea five or six tha doesnt mean you are an expert on my maps gameplay

and obviously you have no idea how the spawn system works
the only reason people would spawn on the other purple room if someone was in that spawn area when they spawned they will spawn in there. next time when you want to try to review someones spawns know what you are talking about

what isnt BTB about this map, which stands for BIG TEAM BATTLE not BIG MAP THAT HOLDS LOTS OF PEOPLE AND AN ASSORTMENT OF VEHICLES, it handles 12-16 players and i have tested with 16 and it works perefectly fine. Just because you only think of the top level as construct does not mean it cant handle the people. There are two other levels that are used and you might be thinking of how bungie uses their construct but mine is not just the top level

now if there are anyother biast and unthought out arguements that you want to throw at me go ahead i will just shut them down as i have before

Gunnergrunt

06-04-2009, 02:42 PM

Sage

06-04-2009, 02:54 PM

Whoa calm down there buddy. We like your map, remember? And you explained the spawn system to me yourself actually... You invited me to your party several times... So yes, I know what I'm talking about.

As for the drop pod entrance. You don't need a hammer or a grenade. You can jump up in the corner and simply melee the supply case... Seems like you would know that..

You're just making a fool of yourself, pal. I would just sit this one out if I were you. You're map will probably do better if you don't talk about it...

i never showed you the map's spawns to you i kinda kept that to myself, and i doubt you are experienced in spawns cuz i remeber azn having to do helping you with your spawns on some of your maps

when you make several lengthy posts about why another map is better and mine shouldnt be in the top 5 the "i like this map, but" basically means i dont want to look like a big dousch and saying i hate the map so i will put this here.

and yea thats one way to do it but again the supply case is suppose to move and it would make it almost impossible to enter the room and get the flag if there was onlyone way into the room

RightSideTheory

06-04-2009, 03:06 PM

I've never shown you my maps spawns, I have kept the information about my spawns myself, and I doubt that you are experienced with spawns because I seem to remember AZN FTW rude comment was here helping you with some of the spawns on your previous maps.

When you make several long and detailed posts about why another map is better, and mine shouldnt be in the top 5, the "I truely like this map, but I'm afraid..." basically means that you don't want to look like a large female hygiene tool and say "I hate the map so i will put this here".

And yes, that's one way to do it, but again the supply case is suppose to move. And it should make it almost impossible to enter the room and claim the flag if there was only one way into the room

Fix'd

doomgrunt

06-04-2009, 03:37 PM

Which is why we need more Supporters. Not everybody can be around all of the time, so we're bound to miss a few Support inputs each time we pick a Top 5. More Supporters == More Initial Feedback.

In case you haven't noticed, the United States, along with many other countries, is in an economical recession. Not everybody can pay x amount of cash every month to have there opinions more heavily considered on an unpopular forum.

Apparently nobody else agreed with you. Where did you come up with that? I agree with him, Conkerkid agrees with him, and I would bet my life that there are others who agree with him. Not everyone is posting in this thread you know.

Sage

06-04-2009, 03:41 PM

In case you haven't noticed, the United States, along with many other countries, is in an economical recession. Not everybody can pay x amount of cash every month to have there opinions more heavily considered on an unpopular forum.

null let me take this one

you apparently dont know anything
1st if you pay you get a full year status of supporter
2nd there are more then one way to get supporter you can A. be a useful member to the site and be liked by most or B. win a contest/shallenge/event.

Null Parameter

06-04-2009, 03:43 PM

Thanks Sage.

Where did you come up with that? I agree with him, Conkerkid agrees with him, and I would bet my life that there are others who agree with him. Not everyone is posting in this thread you know.
And here I meant specifically in the Supporters choosing of the Top 5.

doomgrunt

06-04-2009, 04:12 PM

null let me take this one

you apparently dont know anything
1st if you pay you get a full year status of supporter
Alright, I'm sorry, I didn't know it was an annual payment.

2nd there are more then one way to get supporter you can A. be a useful member to the site and be liked by most or B. win a contest/shallenge/event.
Most people aren't going to win a challenge or event, and the majority of XF members aren't useful to the site.

Null Parameter

06-04-2009, 04:15 PM

and the majority of XF members aren't useful to the site.
And if you aren't going to be useful overall to the site, why should you have a say in the choosing the Top 5?

That question was not rhetorical at all. If you have an answer, I would like to know.

Null Parameter

06-04-2009, 04:57 PM

Announcement

Just so everyone knows, since I forgot to mention this in the first post, votes are being watched and are under a few restrictions, due to past occurrences.

In order for your vote to remain in the official tally, you need to have been a member before the vote was started and you need to have at least 2 posts on XF from before the vote was started.

This is a very small measure against people simply recruiting their friends to join XF only to vote for their map.

I will be looking through all of the votes and making sure that they all match this criteria.

Nulls Wife

06-04-2009, 05:12 PM

Since when does the majority of people disliking the vote mean 3-4 people?

Probably never since Minesweeper is in 2nd place

doomgrunt

06-04-2009, 05:41 PM

And if you aren't going to be useful overall to the site, why should you have a say in the choosing the Top 5?

That question was not rhetorical at all. If you have an answer, I would like to know.

I don't know how many members XF has, but I'm just going to say it has 500 members. How could 500 members all be useful to the site? I think we should have a say in the top five because this is XF, there are good gamers here who aren't of the Supporter status. I don't care if choosing the Top Five is exlusive to colored profiles in the future when there are more colored profiles, and/or the site becomes overpopulated like Forge Hub.

Since when does the majority of people disliking the vote mean 3-4 people?

Probably never since Minesweeper is in 2nd place
Who said anything about 3-4 people?

Silver0range

06-04-2009, 06:22 PM

Please, people, can't we manage to go about providing reasons for votes without taking offense and insulting each other?

Anyhow, I wound up voting for Tetradymite. Most of the maps played well, but seeing as assymetrical games are my personal favorite in Halo 3, I leaned more towards tetradymite in the gameplay situation. Sub-station B was the runner up for me, as it was forged well and the weapons and vehicles really lended themselves well to slayer. It wasn't good for much else, though, due to the nature of Rat's Nest's layout, which has always been one of my lesser favorites for objective gametypes. Minesweeper was a good effort, but a some of the weapons/vehicles seemed out of place (namely the banshee). Not all BTB maps absolutely need to have vehicles; and in the games I played on it the banshee seemed to be little more than a distraction. I enjoyed the fact, however, that gameplay was pretty well spaced out throughout the levels of Construct, rather than just focusing on the lift areas after spawning. However, I'm not going to give you bonus points for forging on Pre-DLC; Tetradymite for me was more enjoyable.

aMoeba

06-04-2009, 06:51 PM

Ameliorate.. a very great 1 sided objective map, I'd say right up there with Utah Mambo. Its nicely balanced and I had lots of fun, which is very important even in a competitive game.

Tetradymite was a second. Not a close second, though. Although the map was good, I feel it was clunky. There were, however, some nice tactical jumps. I pretty much felt lost the entire time while playing Tetradymite, and its too open IMO.

Vale was a decent map. It felt really big - which is crucial for a BTB map. However, cover was very limited. Objective games suffered.

Sub Station B didn't have much going for it except that bridge area, and the fact that you could spawn camp teleporters.

Mine sweeper, IMO, shouldn't even have gotten into the top 5. Its kind of demeaning, especially for how many votes it has. Building the map on construct in the first place shouldn't get you votes because its on construct, but it shouldn't get votes because its on construct. It just isn't fit for BTB.

Wolverine

06-04-2009, 06:58 PM

Vale

Vale has always appealed to me. It has a nice design and has great gameplay. It is very fun and I just like it.

Nulls Wife

06-04-2009, 08:31 PM

I don't think a vote has gone by that the majority has been happy with. .

I agree with him, Conkerkid agrees with him, and I would bet my life that there are others who agree with him. Not everyone is posting in this thread you know.

Who said anything about 3-4 people?

You did, 3 people were really the only people complaining...everyone else respectfully disagreed but you three threw a hissy fit. Throwing around "the majority" and "I'll bet my life" are terrible ways to argue especially since the vote is proving you wrong.

Conkerkid11

06-04-2009, 08:41 PM

No matter how pissed off I am that my map didn't even get in the top five, all I can do is sit and watch as other maps get more attention. I dedicated so much time to Synapse. And for what!? So it could be beat out by 5 supporters who only got that status by paying a monthly fee!? I made a damn You Tube video, the most detailed damn thread you will ever see... *Sigh* this is a sad day for Conker.

By the way, Minesweeper is only getting so much attention because it's a pre-DLC map. I have read through every post supporting it.. They state all the problems with the map, and then come out saying they voted for it because it's not on Sandbox. This contest is bull, and I take back what I said on Forge Hub about this site being great.

Coyote1023

06-04-2009, 08:52 PM

Wow, over-reacting much. I haven't played all the maps, and you know, minesweeper probably did make it because it was pre-DLC. But look at it this way, in the Conquest forgeoff, I had my map on The Pit and got one vote in the finals. It was the two Sandbox ones that excelled. Just deal with it, other people made better maps than you, all you can do it keep trying.

Oh and about the supporter stuff, only 2 or maybe 3 out of the 10+ paid to get it. Many of them had their own maps featured to get it. So go ahead, get mad because you weren't admired by everyone, but don't go and blame it on everyone else. Most of those colored members Play EVERY map before the choose, good luck finding that on FH.

PsychoBucket

06-04-2009, 09:16 PM

Ok that’s enough arguing about this on this thread. This thread is to discuss the top 5 for the May Forgery Challenge. If you want to talk about what maps you thought should have been here, go to private/visitor messages or Skype. If you feel something needs to be changed, then go to the suggestion forum. If I see another post about this here, it will be deleted. Don't make me delete your post!!!

ChAoTiC

06-05-2009, 06:11 AM

I do have a v1.1 of Ameliorate up for download, and yes, the Kill Ball is removed in it.
See the changes and download link here (http://www.forgehub.com/forum/competitive-maps/71452-ameliorate.html)

Maybe that will influence people's decisions.

Sage

06-05-2009, 11:21 AM

can we put an updated version in and have the link on the thread changed to that updated version

Null Parameter

06-05-2009, 11:28 AM

can we put an updated version in and have the link on the thread changed to that updated version
Right now, there is technically no rule specifically against this, but it kind of goes against the "Submit your map by this date", because you are submitting a new version of your map.

Thoughts from anybody else? (Mainly so we can possibly create a rule for future challenges.)

RightSideTheory

06-05-2009, 11:33 AM

Right now, there is technically no rule specifically against this, but it kind of goes against the "Submit your map by this date", because you are submitting a new version of your map.

Thoughts from anybody else? (Mainly so we can possibly create a rule for future challenges.)

I don't think it should be allowed... you have to submit your map by a certain date, changing it to a new version would be exactly like breaking that rule..

Thats just my option by the way, don't put to much stock in it.

PsychoBucket

06-05-2009, 11:44 AM

I don't think it should be allowed... you have to submit your map by a certain date, changing it to a new version would be exactly like breaking that rule..

I agree

K Hood1

06-05-2009, 01:43 PM

Where's Vulcancide?
oh well i guess i choose ameliorite

Silver0range

06-05-2009, 03:07 PM

Yup, I definitely agree that there should be a rule against submitting updated versions; but I don't think that there's really any way to get rid of it other than instating an honor rule - people can always put updated versions of there map in their original thread or something similar, and it would be hard to tell if it was updated or not.

Null Parameter

06-05-2009, 03:09 PM

Sage

06-05-2009, 03:12 PM

that would work and that way there would be no way to find a loop hole or sneak around the rule

Silver0range

06-05-2009, 03:18 PM

I think that would be unnecessary. Anything that changed would either be too small and most likely not affect votes, or be large enough that we could easily pick out cheaters. An honor rule should suffice for now IMO.

aMoeba

06-05-2009, 03:27 PM

Just use A Forgery A's fileshare, I'm sure its already empty.

Null Parameter

06-05-2009, 03:28 PM

Can silver memberships use the File Share?

MickRaider

06-05-2009, 03:54 PM

Can silver memberships use the File Share?You could probably find a 48 hour code for pracitcally nothing and just host them once a month?

Boston

06-05-2009, 03:58 PM

Can silver memberships use the File Share?

Unfortunately no I don't think they can.

Fenian Bhoy

06-05-2009, 04:05 PM

i could go check i has silver :( and im at a loss here with all the maps too choose from.

aMoeba

06-05-2009, 04:10 PM

I wouldn't mind opening up my last few slots, at least for the months I have them.

Fenian Bhoy

06-05-2009, 04:12 PM

we can use A Forgery A's file share i can upload things onto mine so get the maps up there so... wait i dun have gold :'(

GodlyPerfection

06-05-2009, 06:06 PM

Alrighty so since there are a few people wondering why Synapse did not make it into the Top 5 and why Minesweeper did then I will explain it here.

Synapse, is not a big team battle map. The biggest problem with synapse is the lack of paths to take. There are a couple teleporters and then a single U path. This works fine for Team Slayer... however it does not work fine for Big Team Battle. There is a little theory called Combat Dispersion. It is equally spreading out combat so that combat is not congested, hectic, frustrating, and relies on skill not numbers to win. Anyone can build a good Team Slayer map, it takes proper planning to build a BTB map.

All of the current entries either have multiple paths to take. Some of them have a central auto selected path because of distance, but overall you do have that option. They are not really optomized for BTB, they just fit BTB in certain situations. I feel that none of the maps actually felt BTBish. Paths that are taken all the time also pull away from the Combat Dispersion theory and clutters the map. It's fine with 4v4, but you cannot do that with 8v8. Things get to frustrating for players. The other sandbox maps beat yours because they were wide open and not restricted to one U shaped path.

As for Minesweeper, this is a good example as to how to make a pre-DLC map unique... utilize parts of the map that people aren't used to exploring and using. Multiple paths are the only thing that make a big team battle map however... the length of the paths are a big factor as well. Having to walk around to take a lift or a ramp or something adds to more walking distance and forces a feel of a bigger map. Using tricks like putting a platform just a little out of jumping range, forcing players to walk around, enables the dispersion of players allowing for smaller and more focused battles throughout the map. Minesweeper does this decently, but i think the flag spawns could have been chosen MUCH better than what they were to make the map feel bigger.

Synapse is just another competitive map. Good BTB maps standout, cuz people are still learning how to make good ones. Standing out is very important, and if it takes a pre-DLC map to do it then go for it. I strongly feel that you can take almost all of the pre-DLCs and make them into decent BTB maps with proper path manipulation, incentives, and combat dispersion.

BTW if you are good at spawns for a Conquest map, you aren't good at spawns in general. You just understand individual spawn placement. Group spawn placement for multipath maps are more difficult to balance...

Gunnergrunt

06-05-2009, 07:13 PM

BTW if you are good at spawns for a Conquest map, you aren't good at spawns in general. You just understand individual spawn placement. Group spawn placement for multipath maps are more difficult to balance...

And that's why AZN had to help with with my Conquest spawns...

EnsnaredCadaver

06-06-2009, 06:40 AM

I think all the maps are great for many different reasons.

All 3 Sandbox variants are very unique and all had great gameplay, but ultimately Vale won me over.

Minesweeper put Construct to good use, and Sub Station B was a fairly unique take on Rat's Nest.

All the maps are great and all deserve to win, but ultimately it is up to the people to decide.

GD27 ShockWave

06-06-2009, 09:07 AM

Minesweeper
I wish I knew why this beat out my map. I can't see anything on Construct running well with 16 people in the party. I don't even care if you put vehicles on the map, all it would lead to are a bunch of "Whoops I flew into the death barrier!" remarks.

Wow. Minesweeper beat you're map straight up legit. Don't throw a fit because a map doesn't look like its better than yours. Minesweeper is flat out better than 90% of Sandbox maps so far. It is good so it made the top 5. Your map was not so it didn't.

Download the freaking map before you bitch and say "I can't see anything on Construct playing well with 16 people. Way to judge. Minesweeper is the most well thought out map in the ENTIRE contest. That is why it has my vote.